Fingers of Suspicion
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Mafia 18 - Town of FoS
- Thread starter VoidKitten
- Start date
- Tagged users None
Listo95
Moderator
A visit that doesn't actually visit the target.
Claws
All-Knowing
jailor potencially at a risk?
CWE
Godfather
Coven leader... if Void put in the ability to remove cl defense for powerful attack?
Foxxi
Administrator
It's technically possible - but eh. I dunno if I think a jailor would do that N1
Claws
All-Knowing
they would have to be pretty bold d1 i agree
Foxxi
Administrator
It's possible - the original rand had 3 neut roles:
1 Neutral Benign/Neutral Evil
1 Neutral Evil/Apocalypse (80%/20%)
1 Neutral Killer/Apocalypse (60%/40%)
And then Mazer was also added and randed into any legal role so he could be anything
CWE
Godfather
Again..
If it's tos...jailor can't n1 execute.
Foxxi
Administrator
He said he rand'd mazer into any legal role - so I think it's absolutely a possibility. Though it's also just number-wise less likely since there are less neut roles than town or coven
Robozerim
Lost Wolf
Well, since we see that MTR was the Coroner, a good role, I can say (even if you guys can't necessarily take my word for it) that the scum would've been perfectly fine with either of us being lynched yesterday. That means there'd have been no reason for the coven to stack on either because they had nobody to protect at that point. They were probably spread out pretty well when we were the competing trains.
Dreyski, though....it could be that the lynch on them didn't cross the finish line because they're scum, but that's far from sure because of how rare it is for us to actually get a lynch on anybody day 1. From an outside of myself perspective, the train on Dreyski could be an indication of people trying to protect me, which of course looks less than ideal.
Two of the three dead people were voting me. It's likely the kills came from multiple sources, so it's not like coven were choosing to whittle down my train to that extent, but they probably did choose to hit somebody on that train (especially if the Matthieu kill came from a town jailer, or neutral pirate as some people suggest). It could mean that they're not concerned about people focusing on the smaller version of that train because they aren't on it much, which could speak poorly for me again. However, I still know I'm not coven, and I'd still expect them to be spread across the trains from that time of day. I would still guess one person on my train is coven. That's between listo, Satsu, and Dreyski still. It's not a hard lead, but I just find it unlikely that no coven voted against me. Possible, but unlikely.
I'll look through the role cards before I go to bed to confirm what people have been saying about who could have killed Matthieu, given his defense against standard kills.
Dreyski, though....it could be that the lynch on them didn't cross the finish line because they're scum, but that's far from sure because of how rare it is for us to actually get a lynch on anybody day 1. From an outside of myself perspective, the train on Dreyski could be an indication of people trying to protect me, which of course looks less than ideal.
Two of the three dead people were voting me. It's likely the kills came from multiple sources, so it's not like coven were choosing to whittle down my train to that extent, but they probably did choose to hit somebody on that train (especially if the Matthieu kill came from a town jailer, or neutral pirate as some people suggest). It could mean that they're not concerned about people focusing on the smaller version of that train because they aren't on it much, which could speak poorly for me again. However, I still know I'm not coven, and I'd still expect them to be spread across the trains from that time of day. I would still guess one person on my train is coven. That's between listo, Satsu, and Dreyski still. It's not a hard lead, but I just find it unlikely that no coven voted against me. Possible, but unlikely.
I'll look through the role cards before I go to bed to confirm what people have been saying about who could have killed Matthieu, given his defense against standard kills.
Robozerim
Lost Wolf
The has the strength, but not the opportunity list:
Deputy- Powerful attack, but it's a day action and can't be used on day 1 anyway. Doesn't fit a N1 kill.
Trickster- could store any attack to unleash later, but by virtue of the "later" part, couldn't have killed on N1
Bodyguard- Retaliates with a strong attack if their target is attacked. Doesn't fit because the bodyguard would also be hit by a strong attack and isn't one of the flips, and the executioner doesn't actually attack, at least not so early in the game.
Trapper - Could kill with a trap, but I think it indicates you set up the trap on the first night, but it's not active until the next (and others here say that as well). Could be a misinterpretation, and if so they could have killed him.
Conjurer- another day kill with a meteor.
Serial Killer- can do a powerful rampaging attack after two kills, so not possible N1
Arsonist- Needs to set up their kill by dousing people first.
Werewolf- only gets their kill on full moon nights, which exclude N1 and N3.
The Intolerant- Needs to set a word at night before they can choose to do a powerful attack.
The Doomsayer- can't do it N1, and it's a delayed kill so the literal earliest they kill is N3.
Jester- Needs to die by vote first, so impossible.
The has the strength and opportunity list:
Jailor- Could have jailed him day 1 and killed N1, but that's a ballsy choice. It would have to be a very bold player to make that kind of decision so soon into the game.
Veteran- Could have killed any visitors with a powerful attack.
Ritualist- if the jailor's potential killing of Matthieu is ballsy, this one would be insane. They'd have to have guessed the exact role to do an unstoppable attack, and be revealed to all if they failed. Technically possible, but very unlikely.
Pirate- Looks like a rock/paper/scissors mechanic, and if the pirate wins they get an unstoppable attack.
Okay, I've learned a couple things going through the list. The first thing is that holy shit there are a lot of really scary roles in this game. Second is that the candidates are the Pirate and Veteran, followed by the jailor as a distant third, and Ritualist as a technically possible but I would never believe at this point option. Also the trapper if I've misinterpreted how they work.
Deputy- Powerful attack, but it's a day action and can't be used on day 1 anyway. Doesn't fit a N1 kill.
Trickster- could store any attack to unleash later, but by virtue of the "later" part, couldn't have killed on N1
Bodyguard- Retaliates with a strong attack if their target is attacked. Doesn't fit because the bodyguard would also be hit by a strong attack and isn't one of the flips, and the executioner doesn't actually attack, at least not so early in the game.
Trapper - Could kill with a trap, but I think it indicates you set up the trap on the first night, but it's not active until the next (and others here say that as well). Could be a misinterpretation, and if so they could have killed him.
Conjurer- another day kill with a meteor.
Serial Killer- can do a powerful rampaging attack after two kills, so not possible N1
Arsonist- Needs to set up their kill by dousing people first.
Werewolf- only gets their kill on full moon nights, which exclude N1 and N3.
The Intolerant- Needs to set a word at night before they can choose to do a powerful attack.
The Doomsayer- can't do it N1, and it's a delayed kill so the literal earliest they kill is N3.
Jester- Needs to die by vote first, so impossible.
The has the strength and opportunity list:
Jailor- Could have jailed him day 1 and killed N1, but that's a ballsy choice. It would have to be a very bold player to make that kind of decision so soon into the game.
Veteran- Could have killed any visitors with a powerful attack.
Ritualist- if the jailor's potential killing of Matthieu is ballsy, this one would be insane. They'd have to have guessed the exact role to do an unstoppable attack, and be revealed to all if they failed. Technically possible, but very unlikely.
Pirate- Looks like a rock/paper/scissors mechanic, and if the pirate wins they get an unstoppable attack.
Okay, I've learned a couple things going through the list. The first thing is that holy shit there are a lot of really scary roles in this game. Second is that the candidates are the Pirate and Veteran, followed by the jailor as a distant third, and Ritualist as a technically possible but I would never believe at this point option. Also the trapper if I've misinterpreted how they work.
Robozerim
Lost Wolf
CWE
Godfather
Remove trapper. They build n1.
Satsu
Vigilante
Last game he claimed neutral before even going to jail. I can toally see Matt saying he was a neutral that is going to townside.
It could be a pirate, it is possible there are 2 neutral evil. One from first and the other from second row of neutrals.
Claws
All-Knowing
I think xan was extra cheely d1 and idk how i feel about that
Im weary of mazer the sub in then dead silence til eod for 1 post didnt sit well
Robo seems pretty good so do you and cwe seems to be the tos know it all so thats handy
VoidKitten
Cuddly, but Saavy
Day 2 Vote Count:
3puppies - 1 (Claws #322)
Not Voting: 3puppies, Blind Ninja, Caito, CWE, Dreyski, Foxxi, Listo, Mazer, morrison, Robozerim, Satsu, Val the Moofia Boss, Xanjori
It is now Day 2. Day 2 will end at 8:00pm ET on June 11th or when majority is reached. With 14 players alive, majority is 8votes on a single player. If majority is not reached by end of day, there will be no elimination.
3puppies - 1 (Claws #322)
Not Voting: 3puppies, Blind Ninja, Caito, CWE, Dreyski, Foxxi, Listo, Mazer, morrison, Robozerim, Satsu, Val the Moofia Boss, Xanjori
It is now Day 2. Day 2 will end at 8:00pm ET on June 11th or when majority is reached. With 14 players alive, majority is 8votes on a single player. If majority is not reached by end of day, there will be no elimination.
Foxxi
Administrator
What are your thoughts on peeps?
Xanjori
Vigilante
Claws and Robo seem fine
You having me in meh but Drey and Claws in your bottom 3 also makes no sense, seeing as they were 2 of the 3 people I voted for yesterday. For someone that likes to keep things logical that doesnt really track for me
CWE
Godfather
Once again I find myself overwhelmed playing a game against the rest of you who clearly understand the roles of the potential characters far more than I do.
On top of it all, I find myself targeted for an explanation of my D1 activity. Dreyski, since you didn't play the last game, you may have missed the fact that I was town butler, and I served wine to CWE, who we later found out was the Sheriff. This blocked his activity, but still town was doing well, so I didn't explain my action publicly. I had pressed on morrison to explain himself, getting him to divulge that he had the power to heal / protect CWE. The following day, I chose to kill Future, the king, who I thought was scummy, and I got myself killed along the way. This was the beginning of the downfall of town and I feet badly about it.
We move on to this game. I look at it as I owe CWE a favor, and since I know nothing about anyone else, I figured "why not join him?" Not trying to gain favor with him, but just trying to make right a prior wrong in the universe. I didn't want to be a non-voter, and I accept that it's always risky targeting anyone based on nothing at all.
I had been travelling for work last week, so when the weekend hit I wasn't able to really digest the roles out there, as couponing is my priority and I had lots to catch up on. I barely followed along with the voting and we got no yeet. So I added CWE to a guest list, and figured let's have a party at Caito's place. But it looks like the cleric blocked anything from happening at Caito's.
It may be OMGUS, but
Vote: CLAWS
On top of it all, I find myself targeted for an explanation of my D1 activity. Dreyski, since you didn't play the last game, you may have missed the fact that I was town butler, and I served wine to CWE, who we later found out was the Sheriff. This blocked his activity, but still town was doing well, so I didn't explain my action publicly. I had pressed on morrison to explain himself, getting him to divulge that he had the power to heal / protect CWE. The following day, I chose to kill Future, the king, who I thought was scummy, and I got myself killed along the way. This was the beginning of the downfall of town and I feet badly about it.
We move on to this game. I look at it as I owe CWE a favor, and since I know nothing about anyone else, I figured "why not join him?" Not trying to gain favor with him, but just trying to make right a prior wrong in the universe. I didn't want to be a non-voter, and I accept that it's always risky targeting anyone based on nothing at all.
I had been travelling for work last week, so when the weekend hit I wasn't able to really digest the roles out there, as couponing is my priority and I had lots to catch up on. I barely followed along with the voting and we got no yeet. So I added CWE to a guest list, and figured let's have a party at Caito's place. But it looks like the cleric blocked anything from happening at Caito's.
It may be OMGUS, but
Vote: CLAWS
Foxxi
Administrator
Eh. It's the top of the meh pile. And boils down to: I like your vibe, but so far don't have anything that I feel *proves* you good... you and claws both making noises that the robo wagon formed to save mtr now that mtr is known town is eh. And you know as well as I do that voting someone who was never in any danger of yeet is hardly alignment proving even if claws is scum. Plus there are still two more neuts.
Foxxi
Administrator
And no, the cleric mitch would have been refused entry. In this case mitch put in his will that he chose caito N1 - it doesn't mean his attempt succeeded.
Foxxi
Administrator
And to elaborate on caito - I legit don't care about the vanity wagon thing. That's no more AI than it is for CWE.
What bothers me about Caito was that he popped in and made comments to mitch about his dislike of the mathmatics and statistics that felt like he was needling mitch about it - but just to be antagonistic or maybe make me feel better about him since he was kinda siding with me? But in the process of that he ignored the direct question I had posed to him which was part of the conversation he was commenting on.... and then he vanished again.
What bothers me about Caito was that he popped in and made comments to mitch about his dislike of the mathmatics and statistics that felt like he was needling mitch about it - but just to be antagonistic or maybe make me feel better about him since he was kinda siding with me? But in the process of that he ignored the direct question I had posed to him which was part of the conversation he was commenting on.... and then he vanished again.
Claws
All-Knowing
I agree with this aswell
Foxxi
Administrator
Again, the vanity wagon thing for caito is pointless. CWE sat on a vanity wagon too and no one gives two shits about that. It's expected for either of them imo -- even if it's downright infuriating if they are town since town off doing it's own random shit here is even less helpful than usual.
Val on the other hand actually is interesting though.... he usually is all about "gotta yeet people to progress the game"
Val on the other hand actually is interesting though.... he usually is all about "gotta yeet people to progress the game"
Claws
All-Knowing
I think its the fact they never botgered to come back after that inital vote is what bothers me we were grasping at straws to get a train going
Foxxi
Administrator
You feel pockety. I've no idea why you seem to have decided I'm trustworthy.Not sure why im so low on the fox list however i did say the robo train flew up right after the mtr one tbh mtr was being a sarcastic egotistical weiner to me so i thought he was scum
Foxxi
Administrator
He has a bromance with grae - he wants to avenge his friend I imagine, not the role he had.
VoidKitten
Cuddly, but Saavy
Day 2 Vote Count:
Caito - 3 (CWE #341, Foxxi #346, Claws #352)
Claws - 1 (3puppies #343)
Not Voting: Blind Ninja, Caito, Dreyski, Listo, Mazer, morrison, Robozerim, Satsu, Val the Moofia Boss, Xanjori
It is now Day 2. Day 2 will end at 8:00pm ET on June 11th or when majority is reached. With 14 players alive, majority is 8 votes on a single player. If majority is not reached by end of day, there will be no elimination.
Caito - 3 (CWE #341, Foxxi #346, Claws #352)
Claws - 1 (3puppies #343)
Not Voting: Blind Ninja, Caito, Dreyski, Listo, Mazer, morrison, Robozerim, Satsu, Val the Moofia Boss, Xanjori
It is now Day 2. Day 2 will end at 8:00pm ET on June 11th or when majority is reached. With 14 players alive, majority is 8 votes on a single player. If majority is not reached by end of day, there will be no elimination.
Claws
All-Knowing
Like
Likely i dont totally understand this game you are also the only one thats aggressive seeking and you need that in this game more so
Foxxi
Administrator
Ngl my intial reaction was "what even has BN said?" But a quick ISO and I can see this actually. Just didn't feel the same because he's interacted less with me directly I imagine
Listo95
Moderator
I’m under the assumption he was randed under viable roles for this setup. So he could’ve gone anywhere in there. I have him set as an “Any” in my keeping track of claims/flips vs the starting setup.
Either way, I got no results. I was trying to understand what "If a player is rejected, they will be added to the guest list at the start of the next day" meant, because I asked if I would get an updated guest list, and I was told the list would be updated at the end of each night. But the role says " If a player is rejected, they will be added to the guest list at the start of the next day" Does this mean that the cleric mitch would have been added to the guest list the next day?
I had also asked
" If I never add anyone to the guest list, could I indefinitely protect someone by constantly holding the party at their house? "
and I got no response.
Satsu
Vigilante
There are 25 town and 27 non town from quick count. I suppose he could get anything as long as it doesnt duplicate uniques.
Dont think it matters anyway. It is not a big sercet that VK doesnt really really rand roles.
Satsu
Vigilante
Yeah, no way val would wilingly kill matt and i dont think there is a bus driver in this setup. Still it doesnt clear him.
Dreyski
Scum Hunter
First ToS variant game here too and I'm having issues with the role names, although I assume some are analogues of what I'm used to, and I've been brushing up on the wiki so this is where I'm up to:
1 Town Power
1 Town Killing
1 Town Protective - Cleric
2 Town Investigative - Coroner
2 Random Town (any type)
2 Common Town (Support/Protective/Investigative)
1 Coven Power
1 Coven Killing
2 Common Coven (Deception/Utility)
1 Neutral Benign/Neutral Evil
1 Neutral Evil/Apocalypse (80%/20%)
1 Neutral Killer/Apocalypse (60%/40%) - Executioner
(list compiled before Mazer joined). Obviously losing our protective role D1 is a big hurdle, but hopefully theres an extra in the common/random townies. I'll be along later after I've digested the day so far.
1 Town Power
1 Town Killing
1 Town Protective - Cleric
2 Town Investigative - Coroner
2 Random Town (any type)
2 Common Town (Support/Protective/Investigative)
1 Coven Power
1 Coven Killing
2 Common Coven (Deception/Utility)
1 Neutral Benign/Neutral Evil
1 Neutral Evil/Apocalypse (80%/20%)
1 Neutral Killer/Apocalypse (60%/40%) - Executioner
(list compiled before Mazer joined). Obviously losing our protective role D1 is a big hurdle, but hopefully theres an extra in the common/random townies. I'll be along later after I've digested the day so far.
Blind Ninja
Mastermind
If we actually looked at how the day went, I was trying to get as lynch off. I felt better about Robo then I did MTR or Drey. With the way today has started, and the effort Robo is putting in looking through the potential roles/killers, I still feel like he is on the side of town. Not sure evil would put in that much effort.
I will warn/caution people against claiming, if there is a role that guesses peoples role to kill.
Listo95
Moderator
Exe is a neutral evil role.
CWE
Godfather
This. Unless you are a TI. Then claiming is risk free (except conjurer but they can kill anyone right now anyways).
Foxxi
Administrator
I'm assuming you won't get told who all is on your list because that would also tell you who tried to visit your target. You'll only know who you've placed on the list.
I also assume people who try to visit being placed on the list for you is precisely so you can't just protect someone indefinitely.
Mazer
Spirit Breaker
I didn't realize I got subbed in until right before I posted. Then I had tickets to a game that night, and Soccer tryout weekend for my kids.
Trying to get it all in and the role cards now. Bit of a disadvantage now, but I'll make up for it.
Blind Ninja
Mastermind
I think for most of us, this is the 1st ToS game.
All the roles are in discord. I know ive looked at some of them, but havent spent a lot of time pouring over all the options. Decent chunk to take in, similar to the 1st couple games of ToL.
Mazer
Spirit Breaker
Satsu
Vigilante
Most of the roles are simple and already exist in mafia games. Was about how to link what a role does and how it is called here.
Mazer
Spirit Breaker
A whole one faction multi-kill strategy based on whittling down your train seems a little centered
Foxxi
Administrator
Yup. It means we likely have either a veteran who alert'd or a pirate who duel'd matthieu.
And if it is a vet, it's likely someone matthieu would have expected might be chopped with minimal effort. And I doubt he'd pick Val
VoidKitten
Cuddly, but Saavy
Day 2 Vote Count:
Caito - 4 (CWE #341, Foxxi #346, Claws #352, Satsu #373)
Claws - 1 (3puppies #343)
Not Voting: Blind Ninja, Caito, Dreyski, Listo, Mazer, morrison, Robozerim, Val the Moofia Boss, Xanjori
It is now Day 2. Day 2 will end at 8:00pm ET on June 11th or when majority is reached. With 14 players alive, majority is 8 votes on a single player. If majority is not reached by end of day, there will be no elimination.
Caito - 4 (CWE #341, Foxxi #346, Claws #352, Satsu #373)
Claws - 1 (3puppies #343)
Not Voting: Blind Ninja, Caito, Dreyski, Listo, Mazer, morrison, Robozerim, Val the Moofia Boss, Xanjori
It is now Day 2. Day 2 will end at 8:00pm ET on June 11th or when majority is reached. With 14 players alive, majority is 8 votes on a single player. If majority is not reached by end of day, there will be no elimination.
Mazer
Spirit Breaker
Agreed on the last point
Satsu
Vigilante
Even if I was evil I would put a note to my logbook there is a pirate to just out that mf. But I see matt not thinking like that.
Foxxi
Administrator
Mitch - 2 (Claws #10, Foxxi #63)
MTR - 1 (MitchRapp #30)
Caito - 1 (CWE #32)
Claws - 1 (Xanjori #42)
CWE - 1 (Caito #50)
Robo - 1 (Listo #55)
Not Voting: 3puppies, Dreyski, morrison, MTR, Robozerim, Satsu, Val the Moofia Boss, Blind Ninja #25, Matthieu #27
Now that we know Mitch was also town and voting, there's still at least one more non-town in the non-voters here: Drey, morri, Robo, satsu, Val, BN
Of those, I don't think robo is coven. Could be neut, and I feel better about morri than the others. Maybe satsu too.
MTR - 1 (MitchRapp #30)
Caito - 1 (CWE #32)
Claws - 1 (Xanjori #42)
CWE - 1 (Caito #50)
Robo - 1 (Listo #55)
Not Voting: 3puppies, Dreyski, morrison, MTR, Robozerim, Satsu, Val the Moofia Boss, Blind Ninja #25, Matthieu #27
Now that we know Mitch was also town and voting, there's still at least one more non-town in the non-voters here: Drey, morri, Robo, satsu, Val, BN
Of those, I don't think robo is coven. Could be neut, and I feel better about morri than the others. Maybe satsu too.
Satsu
Vigilante
Robos d1 was actually good, nothing eyebrow raising really but i can guarantee you that is in Robos scum range. D2 was very helpfull awesome. But NAI in the end.
I am on just lets keep Robo, leave that for later.
Blind Ninja
Mastermind
I like the arbitrary 9 people "not voting." Guess Matt and Myself should have just left our d1 votes on each other til moving to another train.
Foxxi
Administrator
There is nothing arbitrary about it. It's logic. There are 9 town. That count has nine non-voting people. The more town that we know are actually voting there, the more of the non-voters cannot be town.
This feels needlessly defensive about something that should be helpful to a town pov
Dreyski
Scum Hunter
Yep, realised after I'd skimmed the ToS2 wiki (and now I've found it on Void's discord channels
).
Foxxi
Administrator
This is definitely something to keep in mind, assuming you are town it is unlikely the whole train is pure. Heck, even if you aren't town it's unlikely that train is pure.
How do you feel about these people?
