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kiss mafia

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VC 4
  • Threadmarks
    • LemonDemonGirl(3)-Dreyski, Nightingale, Satsu
    ForgottenHold(2)-Val the Moofia Boss, MTR
    Satsu(1)PsychoSoldier
    Claws(1)-Blind Ninja
    Mazer(1)-Claws
    No Lynch(1)-3puppies
    Val the Moofia Boss(1)-ForgottenHold
    DivaSmurf(1)-CWE


    not voting: VoidKitten, DivaSmurf, LemonDemonGirl, Mazer

    With 15 alive it takes 8 to lynch or no lynch.

    deadline counter
     
    Last edited:
  • Threadmarks
    • rock meets hard place said:
    I was under the impression that this would have made it clear that 8 votes were how a lynch would be achieved and I didn't think it was necessary to spell out that this was a majority only mechanic. I'm sorry if this has caused any confusion. About 14 hours are left in the day phase.
    Click to expand...
    That was the way I read it, but thank your for clarifying.
     
    Vote: sleep

    I'll try to check in. If we need a hammer, I'm willing to. But right now, this gives us nothing information wise, and also because I'm amenable to her changing her mind on her own behalf
    .
     
    That actually didn't take too long

    Not sure I'm fond of the LDG train. Not only is it now officially under Abbi's Law, it definitely built up way quicker than any of the other wagons which doesn't sit quite right. Likely scum there, and if so, likely scum in the other wagons that got to two votes and stalled out.

    I can kinda see Foxxi's vote hopping as coming from a town perspective. I wasn't too into the way she voted Void, but I also think the more erratic and questionable she posts/votes without any justification, the more likely she's not scum. I think she tries to seem a little more reasonable/make up reasoning for her votes when she's scum.

    Satsu just trying to get other people to build up wagons before hopping on, presumably to use Abbi's Law to condemn someone, feels slimy to me. Maybe confbias but nothing Satsu has posted has made me feel like moving my vote.

    I think Mazer has been posting and trying to drive some content while also having fun, without really pointing fingers in any direction. Scum!Mazer is usually more suggestive. Maybe would be more concerned if any of the previous wagons do end up being scum.

    Dreyski is the only vote on LDG I actually like, though not for the vote itself but more that Dreyski's posting comes off like town trying to brush up their skills like he talked about around the turn of the new year. Just has an invested energy that comes off as towny
     
    I am not a fan of this LDG train. I feel like she is town as she usually is and don't see the point of eliminating a known town. I guess we can get some info from the flip and the train but rather go another direction.

    I am willing to follow Pyscho for now and do a counter train on Satsu.

    Unvote:

    Vote: Satsu
     
    I'd vote satsu but then I'll look sus when LDG flips scum, so I'll sit here for now and look sus when satsu flips scum instead.
     
    It's important to have choices. They leave a legacy.

    On one hand, you have the easy path. The one that few people will reject or question. It offers limited glory, but limited blame. It's your classic low ceiling/high floor scenario. It's a tale that everyone is ok with, but nobody's going to read it to their kids at night.

    On the other hand, you have a higher risk path. Who knows if you can even get there? If you succeed, you're above the crowd. If you fail, you tumble all the way don the mountain,

    And there's also a less typical story. It's not your beloved easy narrative. But numbers are the language that unite civilizations.



    It all comes down to which story you choose.


    Hear Cody Rhodes GIF by Andre Arkade
     
    Satsu said:
    Do you think i am higer risk to town than LDG is?
    Or do you think easy path is sleep?
    Click to expand...
    I think you represent a lower floor and higher ceiling. If I was different than neutral about you right now, I might figure differently

    I'm insomniac. Sleep doesn't represent the easier path. That's always a calculation and decision.
     
    I feel its towns duty if ldg has already tossed the towel, she is not gunna help anyways and scum absolutly wont kill her now if she is town.
     
    Satsu said:
    I assure you i am not a neutral. I am town and before game ends you will know it and you will love it.
    Click to expand...

    I wasn't thinking you were a tweener. I'm comfortable that you're a heel or a face. I'm just neutral on my read of which you are.


    But I will admit, this is a good teaser for your story.
     
    PsychoSoldier said:
    Do you have an actual preference for who you prefer?
    Click to expand...
    Sleep.

    I find the LDG train kinda meaningless. If she honestly left, she's likely to be modkilled. And if it wasn't LDG, who we've already have well-worn biases for, I would give at least some more curiousity around an early train. But there's too many mitigating factors here. I also think she's MILDLY more likely to just leave as town, and I haven't really seen anyone make a real accusatory effort.

    I'm always glad to see a counter train, but again....this one is based off a train that I see as having less significance, and so I would only get excited about it if I had reason to be over 50/50 that Satsu was scum. And it's still fairly easy to write off.

    As it is, I see these trains as having less info than expected, and I can't really get to a 50/50 threshold. So I think there's probably a greater chance of a missed shot that doesn't give us much info.

    If you see where I'm neglecting potential information, I'm open to the discussion.

    It's a foolish author who only submits one draft.
     
    Mazer said:
    Sleep.

    I find the LDG train kinda meaningless. If she honestly left, she's likely to be modkilled. And if it wasn't LDG, who we've already have well-worn biases for, I would give at least some more curiousity around an early train. But there's too many mitigating factors here. I also think she's MILDLY more likely to just leave as town, and I haven't really seen anyone make a real accusatory effort.

    I'm always glad to see a counter train, but again....this one is based off a train that I see as having less significance, and so I would only get excited about it if I had reason to be over 50/50 that Satsu was scum. And it's still fairly easy to write off.

    As it is, I see these trains as having less info than expected, and I can't really get to a 50/50 threshold. So I think there's probably a greater chance of a missed shot that doesn't give us much info.

    If you see where I'm neglecting potential information, I'm open to the discussion.

    It's a foolish author who only submits one draft.
    Click to expand...
    For me, it's a lot about the way Satsu has been trying to force someone into the Abbi's Law dichotomy and just sort of emptily pushing for a chop without seeming to have any actual investment in WHO he wants chopped. The flip onto LDG was kind of the final straw for me, but I do also think regardless of previous bias, the pile-on to LDG has likely swept up at least one scum in there.

    I disagree that these trains will have less info if one of them is on scum. But I guess you're argument is that there's not enough info pointing to either of them as scum, hence why these counter wagons aren't up to snuff in your mind?

    I also care less about there being competing wagons and more about pushing for someone I think has better odds of being scum so far.

    Clearly you prefer sleep, but is there anyone you have at closer to 50% than Satsu?
     
    PsychoSoldier said:
    For me, it's a lot about the way Satsu has been trying to force someone into the Abbi's Law dichotomy and just sort of emptily pushing for a chop without seeming to have any actual investment in WHO he wants chopped.
    Click to expand...
    Yes i was trying things many diffent things.

    Hard to believe i am the one trying to do things on d1. Just sad.
     
    PsychoSoldier said:
    Do you actually believe LDG is scum that strongly?
    Click to expand...
    Doesnt matter is she has town or scum on her rolecard.

    She isnt going to be town in other metric.

    If you want to take an easy route dont hammer before 2 hours till deadline or so.

    I want to see if she does something.
     
    How about this... If you are willing to vote LDG out, vote me.

    I dont want to play if we constantly give someone a pass that doesnt do much, if anything, to progress it. The random 1 liners here and there that people say spew her clean, dont help. Then when we get to the endgame, if there is a scum thats always been friendly to her, that can easily sway the vote against town.

    We never lynch her. We never lynch her early. Hell, she really only dies in game when scum get bored and kill her instead of noisy town.


    And @Mazer were you one cautioning against discussing how/when a mod would kill in one of your games? (or was that badger). Why now would we be willing to let the mod remove someone when its our duty to do it, provided they arent advancing the game forward.
     
    yeah sure... Vote LDG or me is the point.

    Because if we are going to let someone get away with actively not playing, I dont want to be here
     
    I will straight up say that im in a neighborhood with 3 other people... which likely means 1 of those 3 is scum. Because I cant see a mod putting 4 town neighbors in a thread.
     
    Blind Ninja said:
    How about this... If you are willing to vote LDG out, vote me.

    I dont want to play if we constantly give someone a pass that doesnt do much, if anything, to progress it. The random 1 liners here and there that people say spew her clean, dont help. Then when we get to the endgame, if there is a scum thats always been friendly to her, that can easily sway the vote against town.

    We never lynch her. We never lynch her early. Hell, she really only dies in game when scum get bored and kill her instead of noisy town.


    And @Mazer were you one cautioning against discussing how/when a mod would kill in one of your games? (or was that badger). Why now would we be willing to let the mod remove someone when its our duty to do it, provided they arent advancing the game forward.
    Click to expand...
    Don't think that was me. The only time I can think of something similar was me warning about overdiscussing if I killed someone for breadcrumbing or roleclaiming. That's a different thing though.

    I've always allowed people to discuss actual game mechanics. I wouldn't understand how to play most games without mechanic discussions.
     
    Mazer said:
    Don't think that was me. The only time I can think of something similar was me warning about overdiscussing if I killed someone for breadcrumbing or roleclaiming. That's a different thing though.

    I've always allowed people to discuss actual game mechanics. I wouldn't understand how to play most games without mechanic discussions.
    Click to expand...
    Modkills arent a general game mechanic though... and why rely on the mod to remove people when that is the players duty to solve the game.
     
    Blind Ninja said:
    Modkills arent a general game mechanic though... and why rely on the mod to remove people when that is the players duty to solve the game.
    Click to expand...
    If I think it's solving, I agree. Perhaps we see our "duty" differently?

    I've already said why I think this is a low probability play. Look, I'm not arguing with you if you want to talk about removing a lower participation player. I just don't see the point if it gives me nothing really to go off of, takes scum 1 place closer to control earlier, and its likely that someone else will do it.

    You and claws have mentioned duty. I guess I see my duty as playing the best way to win vs. having to personally remove a player for something that I don't like that has little utility. It's not as if I imagine LDG is going to come back and in completely dominate the thread on a bad lynch.

    I have 3 duties:

    1. Play to procure a win
    2. Finish the Story
    3. Please the booty
     
    I understand the frustration of someone not active and maybe not doing actions but to me that is the mod's place to handle that. I don't want to knowingly take out a town person and help scum get the numbers they need if I can be trying to actively solve and maybe taking out a scum.
     
    MTR said:
    I understand the frustration of someone not active and maybe not doing actions but to me that is the mod's place to handle that. I don't want to knowingly take out a town person and help scum get the numbers they need if I can be trying to actively solve and maybe taking out a scum.
    Click to expand...
    I agree, its the mods place to handle, BEFORE the game. During the game, its the players. Modkills werent typically for activity, when they were used.
     
    Mazer said:
    Sleep.

    I find the LDG train kinda meaningless. If she honestly left, she's likely to be modkilled. And if it wasn't LDG, who we've already have well-worn biases for, I would give at least some more curiousity around an early train. But there's too many mitigating factors here. I also think she's MILDLY more likely to just leave as town, and I haven't really seen anyone make a real accusatory effort.

    I'm always glad to see a counter train, but again....this one is based off a train that I see as having less significance, and so I would only get excited about it if I had reason to be over 50/50 that Satsu was scum. And it's still fairly easy to write off.

    As it is, I see these trains as having less info than expected, and I can't really get to a 50/50 threshold. So I think there's probably a greater chance of a missed shot that doesn't give us much info.

    If you see where I'm neglecting potential information, I'm open to the discussion.

    It's a foolish author who only submits one draft.
    Click to expand...
    100% she wont be mk and she wont be murdered by scum its day 1 if shes not willing to play. Oh shit fuck goodbye.
     
    DivaSmurf said:
    I’m currently reading hobbit and going to continue on to the Lord of the Rings books after
    Click to expand...

    Great books. I loved the last act of The Hobbit. Beware that the first 80 pages of Fellowship are pretty boring since it's about a party. Then they start hearing about rumors of wars and it begins picking up but it didn't become really engaging for me until they reached Bree and you realize that there are enemy spies everywhere and it's fantastic from then on.
     
    As for LDG, she's been playing for a few years so I'd expect her to be comfortable voting and getting voted by now. It is D1 though so we have nothing to go on (besides Blind Ninja being in a neighborhood) so I think she could be forgiven for not knowing what to do, but later on you could @ her for reads and thoughts on the topic of the day to get her to build patterns.
     
    Val the Moofia Boss said:
    As for LDG, she's been playing for a few years so I'd expect her to be comfortable voting and getting voted by now. It is D1 though so we have nothing to go on (besides Blind Ninja being in a neighborhood) so I think she could be forgiven for not knowing what to do, but later on you could @ her for reads and thoughts on the topic of the day to get her to build patterns.
    Click to expand...
    Thats all well and good. But 90% of the time you @ her to ask any questions, she ignores them or responds with something along the lines of "I forgot this game was going"
     
    Blind Ninja said:
    I agree, its the mods place to handle, BEFORE the game. During the game, its the players. Modkills werent typically for activity, when they were used.
    Click to expand...
    I don't think we should feel the need to take out inactive players. Again mod's job. If we waste time taking out inactive players that tend to be town we are just helping scum by not focusing on solving and getting reads on players. Again I understand the frustration because I get extremely frustrated as well and try to not let it get to me.

    If you guys want to take her out by all means. At least we get the flip but rather put focus elsewhere. We have this discussion all the time much like we have the day one discussion all the time. Lets just play and not worry about activity and let that get sorted out on its own later.
     
    LDG is always a tough read, but the fact that she seems to rand town much more than scum, and that she often isn't all that engaged in solving, does not have a bearing on how she randed this time.

    For those that want to vote her for the sake of getting info, I am surprised that nobody came out to say they're voting her because she's been on the winning side for a couple games in row.

    I don't feel great about anyone yet, and I don't think anyone should, because we simply don't have info. I tend to lean BN town for simply reporting that he's in a neighborhood with 4 others.

    I am not in a neighborhood.

    DivaSmurf said:
    I was eating a bagel while catching up and I dropped it cream cheese side landed on the floor
    Click to expand...

    Found your problem. Bagels are better with peanut butter. Cream cheese is best used for frosting, danish strips or better yet, cheesecakes.
     
    MTR said:
    I don't think we should feel the need to take out inactive players. Again mod's job. If we waste time taking out inactive players that tend to be town we are just helping scum by not focusing on solving and getting reads on players. Again I understand the frustration because I get extremely frustrated as well and try to not let it get to me.

    If you guys want to take her out by all means. At least we get the flip but rather put focus elsewhere. We have this discussion all the time much like we have the day one discussion all the time. Lets just play and not worry about activity and let that get sorted out on its own later.
    Click to expand...
    This just screams "Im lazy" and LDG is on my scum team from you.

    Its the players job to solve the game. Not rely on the mod to have to come in and take actions. (for whatever reason)

    If people cant be active in the game and contribute, they shouldnt be signing up.

    Again, once the game has started, removing players DETRIMENTAL to to, is the games responsibility. Being inactive, hurts town.
     
    Removing any town, even an inactive town, hurts town, as scum need to get a majority.

    I disagree that inactive town members do not help town as much as they potentially could and should, but don't forget that they are still part of the numbers we need.
     
    3puppies said:
    Removing any town, even an inactive town, hurts town, as scum need to get a majority.

    I disagree that inactive town members do not help town as much as they potentially could and should, but don't forget that they are still part of the numbers we need.
    Click to expand...
    I agree with this, also to add on there’s always the potential she could submit actions this game if she has a town role with actions, I don’t think we should yet her day one
     
    Being overly hungry for a yeet on D1 where we don't have much info, usually results in a town loss.

    I don't mean to overly defend anyone for lack of activity. I just don't see enough value in a yeet yet.
     
    Blind Ninja said:
    This just screams "Im lazy" and LDG is on my scum team from you.

    Its the players job to solve the game. Not rely on the mod to have to come in and take actions. (for whatever reason)

    If people cant be active in the game and contribute, they shouldnt be signing up.

    Again, once the game has started, removing players DETRIMENTAL to to, is the games responsibility. Being inactive, hurts town.
    Click to expand...
    I am lazy because I rather interact with the active people and get reads instead wasting time getting rid of a person not doing anything? Really? Come on. Do better. I am not disagreeing with you about if people are not going to be active then don't sign up and the frustration it causes. I also agree that it hurts town if they are not helping. However I am just going to focus on what I have in front of me and not get distracted by inactive players. I would rather scum hunt then just hand scum numbers by taking inactives out that are likely town and wasting a chance to take out a scum.

    All this discussion right here is distracting us from the actual game and is just as frustrating as people being inactive to me.
     
    3puppies said:
    Being overly hungry for a yeet on D1 where we don't have much info, usually results in a town loss.

    I don't mean to overly defend anyone for lack of activity. I just don't see enough value in a yeet yet.
    Click to expand...
    Normally I am right there with you but I get the feeling we are not going to get the write ups that a lot of us are used to so I am okay with yeeting someone day one and trying to get what info we can from that flip and train analysis.
     
    And for anyone that cares, I know that I swore that I would not lead a D1 sleep train after I got killed for it in my first game ever. I am taking the risk that our mod is not a bastard and that this game is keeping it simple for me.

    I would rather wait a day, and see what if anything the write up gives us, before we ack recklessly.
     
    3puppies said:
    Removing any town, even an inactive town, hurts town, as scum need to get a majority.

    I disagree that inactive town members do not help town as much as they potentially could and should, but don't forget that they are still part of the numbers we need.
    Click to expand...
    Lets say that LDG is hypothetically town that just adds 2 posts a day, but doesnt help solve or hinder scum in any way... Now scum will just cut out the active members of town, leaving us with fewer and fewer people that are actively engaging. An inactive town is basically scum, since they wont remove that person and that person isnt coming solving.
     
    3puppies said:
    Being overly hungry for a yeet on D1 where we don't have much info, usually results in a town loss.

    I don't mean to overly defend anyone for lack of activity. I just don't see enough value in a yeet yet.
    Click to expand...
    getting no yeet on d1... and no information in the writeup doesnt help town either.

    town cannot win without yeets. and an inactive town hurts town in the end.
     
    MTR said:
    I am lazy because I rather interact with the active people and get reads instead wasting time getting rid of a person not doing anything? Really? Come on. Do better. I am not disagreeing with you about if people are not going to be active then don't sign up and the frustration it causes. I also agree that it hurts town if they are not helping. However I am just going to focus on what I have in front of me and not get distracted by inactive players. I would rather scum hunt then just hand scum numbers by taking inactives out that are likely town and wasting a chance to take out a scum.

    All this discussion right here is distracting us from the actual game and is just as frustrating as people being inactive to me.
    Click to expand...
    Well... the inactive person is in the game... but discussing the inactive person is distracting you from the game?

    Instead of saying how this is distracting, want to add anything else that isnt about this lone topic?
     
    Blind Ninja said:
    Lets say that LDG is hypothetically town that just adds 2 posts a day, but doesnt help solve or hinder scum in any way... Now scum will just cut out the active members of town, leaving us with fewer and fewer people that are actively engaging. An inactive town is basically scum, since they wont remove that person and that person isnt coming solving.
    Click to expand...
    I understand this logic and this goes back to hoping the game runner takes care of the inactives by subs are getting rid of them early on before we get to this point.
     
    The fact that ldg just said fone and self voted instead of throwing a fit like she usually does seems telling to me
     
    Blind Ninja said:
    Well... the inactive person is in the game... but discussing the inactive person is distracting you from the game?

    Instead of saying how this is distracting, want to add anything else that isnt about this lone topic?
    Click to expand...
    This seems to be the currently topic of discussion so going with it. Not like this is the only thing I have talked about this day phase.
     
    Blind Ninja said:
    getting no yeet on d1... and no information in the writeup doesnt help town either.

    town cannot win without yeets. and an inactive town hurts town in the end.
    Click to expand...

    Are you intentionally missing the distinction between a town yeet and a scum yeet? A town yeet of an inactive town makes scum one step closer to their majority.

    Town can - and has - won plenty of times by refusing to yeet on D1 when we have no information. Don't make it seem like we're setting up an impossible task for ourselves.

    I don't know how you can say for sure what the writeups will or won't have.

    I am not suggesting that town should never yeet anyone in the phases to come. Isn't it just as likely that we will either get info from a writeup, or from someone sharing deets, than not?
     
    MTR said:
    This seems to be the currently topic of discussion so going with it. Not like this is the only thing I have talked about this day phase.
    Click to expand...
    You act like shes gunna be afk she wont be mk she will pop in and out to say 1 thing
     
    Claws said:
    The fact that ldg just said fone and self voted instead of throwing a fit like she usually does seems telling to me
    Click to expand...
    That is what she tends to do though. Says fuck it or fine or whatever and self votes. She really hasn't thrown a fit that I can remember in a while.
     
    MTR said:
    I understand this logic and this goes back to hoping the game runner takes care of the inactives by subs are getting rid of them early on before we get to this point.
    Click to expand...
    This also comes back to, ONCE the game starts, Its the players responsibility to solve and remove people... Not the mods.
     
    3puppies said:
    Are you intentionally missing the distinction between a town yeet and a scum yeet? A town yeet of an inactive town makes scum one step closer to their majority.

    Town can - and has - won plenty of times by refusing to yeet on D1 when we have no information. Don't make it seem like we're setting up an impossible task for ourselves.

    I don't know how you can say for sure what the writeups will or won't have.

    I am not suggesting that town should never yeet anyone in the phases to come. Isn't it just as likely that we will either get info from a writeup, or from someone sharing deets, than not?
    Click to expand...
    I HIGHLY doubt we will have massive detailed writeups full of information. If you are refusing to yeet someone today, why not toss in the towel and not yeet all game. A day 1 yeet will provide information and providde some catalyst for d2, provided nothing too telling comes from n1 actions.

    Not to mention, we dont know if LDG is scum or town. So hard to say which way this yeet will land til it happens
     
    3puppies said:
    Are you intentionally missing the distinction between a town yeet and a scum yeet? A town yeet of an inactive town makes scum one step closer to their majority.

    Town can - and has - won plenty of times by refusing to yeet on D1 when we have no information. Don't make it seem like we're setting up an impossible task for ourselves.

    I don't know how you can say for sure what the writeups will or won't have.

    I am not suggesting that town should never yeet anyone in the phases to come. Isn't it just as likely that we will either get info from a writeup, or from someone sharing deets, than not?
    Click to expand...
    While I do not share Blind Ninja's opinion that removing anyone that does not play is the sole and exclusive responsibility of the players, and that to consider a game mechanic is sign of moral delinquency and dereliction in out mandate to defend the sacred timeline....

    I do have enough familiarity with different game styles and statements that Rock has made that make me strongly agree that there is very little chance we're getting much more than non-action related narrative and the name of the person who died from the write-ups. I think Blind Ninja is genuine in what he's projecting.
     
    3puppies said:
    Are you intentionally missing the distinction between a town yeet and a scum yeet? A town yeet of an inactive town makes scum one step closer to their majority.

    Town can - and has - won plenty of times by refusing to yeet on D1 when we have no information. Don't make it seem like we're setting up an impossible task for ourselves.

    I don't know how you can say for sure what the writeups will or won't have.

    I am not suggesting that town should never yeet anyone in the phases to come. Isn't it just as likely that we will either get info from a writeup, or from someone sharing deets, than not?
    Click to expand...
    Going off my role card and that he said he was trying to do a more traditional game prior to this game that only info we get from the write up is the death and then wait and see if people share info or make claims. I could be wrong and we won't know for sure until the first write up. So that makes me get on the yeet someone day 1 train instead of sleep train.
     
    On the topic of people that are not LDG, I don't hate Satsu's response to Psych's pressure. A question is whether a scum psych would feel the need to do anything different when there was already a train on LDG.
     
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